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  #441  
Old 01-12-2015, 10:15 PM
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Originally Posted by luxe View Post
and no disrespect, but i don't see why you get to say what's a good reason and what isn't when you have a vagina of your own. our uterus has been built up for so long as this object that can be dictated by others. it's getting really annoying to hear people tell others what they can/cannot do with it. that's none of mine/yours/theirs/his/her business - unless the uterus in question belongs to the person making the choice.

i agree that my/your/our tax dollars should not go towards aiding those who abuse abortions because that's not right - but I refuse to let anyone dictate someone else's reproductive rights. Your belief can govern your own uterus, leave other women to the same right. we don't get to make that choice for the other 7,287,521,260 people on this planet. that's just cruel, immoral and wrong.

people are allowed to have different religions, beliefs and ideas - just because you don't agree does not mean that we can tell them to go away. worry about your body and leave other people alone!
Well damn...

I get to express my opinion just as you do also.

I am by no means stopping anybody from having an abortion. Your right, That is their body, their choice, but killing something (even though it may not be considered "alive" in your eyes) is still, in my eyes, In God's eye's, and many others' eye's is murder, even though you may not think so.

And no, whats Immoral is abortion, THAT'S whats immoral. It's not wrong to simply state that its not the best option. If you had sex, and you consented to that sex, and you became pregnant, and you were going to have an Abortion because YOU did something that caused that, That's not right. That's your own problem, Ya know? I mean, whether you agree with me or not, I don't care. I'm gonna take the stand on, It needs to be illegal. But for now, It's not, So I have no actual choice to keep somebody from Aborting, their just my thoughts.

You know, 85% of women end up regretting their Abortions. They react with negative reactions to the Abortion they had including sorrow, sadness, guilt, regret, grief and disappointment.

Plus, your right, People have their own beliefs, So let me have mine.

No disrespect



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  #442  
Old 01-12-2015, 11:52 PM
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Abortion doesnt need to be illegal. People need to be better educated.



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  #443  
Old 01-12-2015, 11:57 PM
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People need to be better educated.
Mhmm.



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  #444  
Old 01-16-2015, 05:38 PM
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Originally Posted by kvm View Post
Well damn...

I get to express my opinion just as you do also.

I am by no means stopping anybody from having an abortion. Your right, That is their body, their choice, but killing something (even though it may not be considered "alive" in your eyes) is still, in my eyes, In God's eye's, and many others' eye's is murder, even though you may not think so.

And no, whats Immoral is abortion, THAT'S whats immoral. It's not wrong to simply state that its not the best option. If you had sex, and you consented to that sex, and you became pregnant, and you were going to have an Abortion because YOU did something that caused that, That's not right. That's your own problem, Ya know? I mean, whether you agree with me or not, I don't care. I'm gonna take the stand on, It needs to be illegal. But for now, It's not, So I have no actual choice to keep somebody from Aborting, their just my thoughts.

You know, 85% of women end up regretting their Abortions. They react with negative reactions to the Abortion they had including sorrow, sadness, guilt, regret, grief and disappointment.

Plus, your right, People have their own beliefs, So let me have mine.

No disrespect
I think what @luxe was trying to say is it's not that you have an opposing opinion, it's that you address the moral as if your opinion is rule. "THAT'S immoral". People's idea of immoral varies from person to person; Luxe doesn't think it's immoral for a woman to be able to choose, but you do.

Addressing 'Religion'
( Click to show/hide )
Me, I'm a believer that all religions are universal...and I don't think it's fair that other people use their God(whichever God it may be) to tell me what's wrong at right. If God has a problem with someone's choice, then that is between the person in question and God when they have their final judgement. It's not up to anyone else but God alone. Which is why the Separation of Church and State exists. To quote Luxe:

Quote:
Your belief can govern your own uterus, leave other women to the same right. we don't get to make that choice for the other 7,287,521,260 people on this planet.
She means it's not fair to let one set of be the standard of what is fair for everyone else. That's why it should be illegal. Too many people have too many beliefs for one to hold over the rest. That's not what this country is about.

The point is, if you think it's murder - you have your own choice not to have an abortion. Don't do it. But because you believe in God and you think God would say it was wrong does not mean that everyone else should have to follow that standard as well.


Addressing 'you're killing an unborn baby!'
( Click to show/hide )

Firstly, if a fetus cannot live without a host... it is not something that lives for itself. I'm sorry, I think babies are adorable as well, but that's the cold hard truth here. They require the mother to be able to develop and, eventually, come into this world, which does not mean that it's alive.

The baby grows tissue that resembles fingernails at 3 weeks, but that's the only serious development until month 3. Statistics show that almost all abortions happen within the first 3 months, before it has a heartbeat, before it has brain tissue and before it has nerve endings to feel. (statistics can be found here)


Now if we're going to talk about death, let's talk about the moms who have to, unwillingly, have late-trimester abortions. The ones that occur late in the pregnancy.
Did you know that less than 1% of those are performed on women who don't want their babies?
That's more than 99% of women who actually wanted that baby, and have to give it up.

Why? Birth defects that will cause the baby to be stillborn, cause the infant to suffer until it dies way too soon or is a a threat to the mother's health.

Do you know how much mental trauma occurs when a woman is forced to give birth to a baby that's been dead inside of her? No, you don't. You can't image it. Feeling this baby you're excited to have one day, suddenly silent and still for weeks or months until you give birth and hey! Guess what. It's dead. That's immoral to wish upon someone, man, just because you don't like the idea of abortion.


Addressing the women who died before Roe V Wade and women who still die in countries where abortion is illegal.
( Click to show/hide )

And more death? Before Roe Vs Wade, which legalized abortion in 1973, women died from back alley abortions. Like my Aunt. They did not have a safe place to have an abortion and had them done with wire-hangers, with pliers, and by people with vans and unsanitary back rooms in their houses.

Link here: x

Now how many women die from botched abortions? Near none In countries where abortions are still illegal? 47,000. Those are women who did not have to die, but because their country does not like abortions.


In conclusion,
There's a reason abortion is legal. It's not just purely based on belief or what's 'right and wrong' but based on so much more than that. But fetus rights seem to outweigh the 3% chance that the child will be adopted after birth, or the fact that thousands of women have/will die because of illegal procedures if it's made illegal again.

Pro Roe vs Wade.
Pro Life - in regards to health of the mother in all aspects.
Pro Choice - because our bodies are for our choice, not someone elses.
And pro fact.

So here are facts about illegal abortions, life before Roe vs Wade. Read them, educate yourselves, and maybe we'll be able to agree that you can govern your own body but not someone else's.

World Health Organization
Think Progress 1
Think Progress 2 (About attempts to ban birth control)
A CATHOLIC Website pointing out that women will die if abortions are made illegal
Pro Choice America
Before Roe vs Wade - A Prologue
Wikipedia on Unsafe Abortions

And also:
Statistics on Adoption



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  #445  
Old 02-26-2015, 08:56 AM
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You know, 85% of women end up regretting their Abortions. They react with negative reactions to the Abortion they had including sorrow, sadness, guilt, regret, grief and disappointment.
I think a lot of this has to do with society telling her she has killed a baby and that she is immoral as opposed to just accepting she has undergone a medical procedure. I think if there was no longer a stigma attached to abortion and you didn't have people standing outside abortion clinics harassing women and making them feel guilty about their choices that statistic would drop. Also, considering something like 1 in 3 women have an abortion in their lifetime, a report based on 500 women is not exactly accurate.



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  #446  
Old 03-07-2015, 05:20 PM
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I may be 12, and still am a little person, but I know that raising a child is hard, not wanting is okay, BUT there are adoption centers where some people can't have kids and are willing to have the child and care for it! In the 10 commandments it says you may not kill, having an abortion is killing the baby, it may not be born, but the first thing that a baby develops when it is in the womb is a heart a once that heart is beating that is the start of a life, so if you don't want a baby, simple as use a condom or don't have sex. A miscarriage is different then an abortion a miscarriage is an accident like my mom was once driving and then my twin brothers died in her stomach, because she got in a car accident, that wasn't her fault! My aunt can't have kids and is dying to have one she wanted to take my sister and raise her for my mom! She went to my mom while she was pregnet and asked to have my older sister and that my mom can have another child, but my mom said no because she wanted to raise her, but honestly being pregnet is hard, because I saw my mom's friend when she was prego and it looked painful, but if some teens decide to have sex, they should know the risks of being preganet and simply just wait till marriage, it's not like sex is going to runaway from you, it's simply called waiting, so I am against abortions, because this is a cause and effect matter you don't have to kill a human being, just because you don't want to pregnet THAT'S YOUR FAULT THEREFORE DON'T KILL THIS BABY'S CHANCE TO MAKE A DIFFERENCE IN THE WORLD IT'S ALL YOUR FAULT YOU GOT PREGNET SO DON'T KILL THE BABY AND MAKE IT SUFFER! Even if you get raped, you may feel uncomfortable holding a rapiest baby, but don't commit a sin and kill the baby, it's not your fault you did get raped, but put the baby up for adoption and simple as that



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  #447  
Old 03-07-2015, 07:26 PM
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I may be 12, and still am a little person, but I know that raising a child is hard, not wanting is okay, BUT there are adoption centers where some people can't have kids and are willing to have the child and care for it! In the 10 commandments it says you may not kill, having an abortion is killing the baby, it may not be born, but the first thing that a baby develops when it is in the womb is a heart a once that heart is beating that is the start of a life, so if you don't want a baby, simple as use a condom or don't have sex. A miscarriage is different then an abortion a miscarriage is an accident like my mom was once driving and then my twin brothers died in her stomach, because she got in a car accident, that wasn't her fault! My aunt can't have kids and is dying to have one she wanted to take my sister and raise her for my mom! She went to my mom while she was pregnet and asked to have my older sister and that my mom can have another child, but my mom said no because she wanted to raise her, but honestly being pregnet is hard, because I saw my mom's friend when she was prego and it looked painful, but if some teens decide to have sex, they should know the risks of being preganet and simply just wait till marriage, it's not like sex is going to runaway from you, it's simply called waiting, so I am against abortions, because this is a cause and effect matter you don't have to kill a human being, just because you don't want to pregnet THAT'S YOUR FAULT THEREFORE DON'T KILL THIS BABY'S CHANCE TO MAKE A DIFFERENCE IN THE WORLD IT'S ALL YOUR FAULT YOU GOT PREGNET SO DON'T KILL THE BABY AND MAKE IT SUFFER! Even if you get raped, you may feel uncomfortable holding a rapiest baby, but don't commit a sin and kill the baby, it's not your fault you did get raped, but put the baby up for adoption and simple as that
"! In the 10 commandments it says you may not kill, having an abortion is killing the baby, it may not be born, but the first thing that a baby develops when it is in the womb is a heart a once that heart is beating that is the start of a life, so if you don't want a baby, simple as use a condom or don't have sex. " You can not bring religion up to make it illegal. Not everyone believes in God, simple as that.
It is not murder to abort as you technically have to be able to be living unassisted on your own to be considered a baby.

" if some teens decide to have sex, they should know the risks of being preganet and simply just wait till marriage, it's not like sex is going to runaway from you, it's simply called waiting, so I am against abortions, because this is a cause and effect matter you don't have to kill a human being, just because you don't want to pregnet THAT'S YOUR FAULT THEREFORE DON'T KILL THIS BABY'S CHANCE TO MAKE A DIFFERENCE IN THE WORLD IT'S ALL YOUR FAULT YOU GOT PREGNET SO DON'T KILL THE BABY AND MAKE IT SUFFER! Even if you get raped, you may feel uncomfortable holding a rapiest baby, but don't commit a sin and kill the baby, it's not your fault you did get raped, but put the baby up for adoption and simple as that "

One: You can have protected sex and STILL get pregnant, Two, waiting til marriage is not what everyone is going to do. Not everyone is going to get married. Sex is not a bad thing and people should not have to wait until marriage because you don't want to marry someone and then find out there's no chemistry in bed... Three, only some people who have been raped are able to carry the baby to term. Do you know what the rape itself does to a woman psychologically? I am going to assume you do. By practically saying that the victim should be forced to keep the baby even though in this scenario she didn't even consent to sex, she will relive her rape for those nine months of having the rapist's spawn inside her.

Also you say it is simple to just put the baby up for adoption but how many of these kids who end up in the system actually get adopted?

Here are some hard cold facts about adoption itself.

"In the U.S. 397,122 children are living without permanent families in the foster care system. 101,666 of these children are eligible for adoption, but nearly 32% of these children will wait over three years in foster care before being adopted." (http://www.acf.hhs.gov/sites/default...rsreport20.pdf) What do you think happens to the children who are not eligible for adoption and what about those who wait OVER three years? Not three years but over three years. Over three years can be six years...it could possibly be their whole childhood.

People who adopt tend to want the perfect child as well. So if the child in the system isn't "perfect", they usually sit in the system for a while. Several children never find their forever home.

The Foster System is not perfect.

There is already several children without a mother and a father.

If someone wants to get an abortion, and it's still within the legal amount of months, let her.

Not everyone was made for pregnancy even if the body can do it, not every woman has the mental capacity to be able to do such a thing; not every woman have the capacity to carry their rapist's baby to term.



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  #448  
Old 03-08-2015, 08:14 AM
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Not everyone was made for pregnancy even if the body can do it, not every woman has the mental capacity to be able to do such a thing; not every woman have the capacity to carry their rapist's baby to term.
this may be the truest thing you've ever said. no woman should be forced into having a child- raped or not. I personally do not have the mental strength or physical ability to raise and birth a child. my mental health would greatly deteriorate to the extent where I would not he able to be a mother at all.
no person should be forced into motherhood- that's more of a sin than having an abortion in my opinion.



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Old 03-08-2015, 09:58 PM
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on a similar note, even if one can look past the physical risks of having a baby, there are also mental risks involved when it comes to postpartum blues/depression/psychosis. a person should not have to subject themselves to these risks if they don't want to.



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  #450  
Old 04-17-2015, 12:06 AM
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I think a lot of this has to do with society telling her she has killed a baby and that she is immoral as opposed to just accepting she has undergone a medical procedure. I think if there was no longer a stigma attached to abortion and you didn't have people standing outside abortion clinics harassing women and making them feel guilty about their choices that statistic would drop. Also, considering something like 1 in 3 women have an abortion in their lifetime, a report based on 500 women is not exactly accurate.
I'll give you this one. I understand.



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Old 07-14-2015, 04:48 PM
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I am pro-choice.
Children deserve the best in life,
If you aren't in the position to offer that, termination before suffering is humane.
You wouldn't allow a dog to suffer in pain, why should a child?



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